Main Line Slope

[backyardsugarer]

I am finally going to do it. Now that I have a 400 gallon tank I am going to run a 3/4 main line to about 60 - 70 taps. My yard is flat and I have no vac. . How much slope do I need and how high up the trees can I go when tapping?
Also do you guys use a level or what to determine if you have the right slope?

Chris

[lobstafari]

I use a sight level, and try too keep it at a 4 percent minimum. You can tap as high as you want, of course its more convenient to tap lower. I have a few trees tapped at about 10 feet. Some of my mainline runs around 3 percent in spots...I just put more supports on it and hope for the best. I dont use a conductor line setup, and also no vacuum. Make sure its up on 9 ga wire, and supported every foot or so with loop ties or zip ties, then side stays, or boards underneath every 25 feet or so, to eliminate sags. I use saddle connectors, which I guess some of the vacuum people hate because they tend to leak, but I find theyre easier to work with. The 5/16 rigid is the worst to work with, but runs the best, and is easy to clean. I used semi rigid for all my drops, then discovered rigid kinks less, and is easier there, too....go figure. Id go semi rigid (royal blue/red stripe) if you dont have a tubing tool, and rigid if you do (light blue,gray,or green). Maybe they come in other colors, I dunno. OK enough of my rambling....good luck. :)

[mapleman9000]

with that amount of taps on a line, you could go with a smaller tank and a 1/2 in. line. it would at least be cheaper for the line and fittings. my set up is exactly the same as lobstafari.

[lobstafari]

I spaced the tank size thing...seems like a 150 gal stock tank would be plenty, unless you were planning on going away for a bit. I use a 300 gal tank for 200 taps, then a 500 gal tank to store that and whatever I get out of 150 buckets, but I get to boil all day/everyday too. I think I heard somewhere 1/2" mains are no good and to go with at least 3/4". Never tried 1/2", but maybe not enough air exchange? or just someones opinion. Sure could save some dough using 1/2"

[mapleman9000]

i have several varying number of taps on several 1/2 in. mainline. the largest of which is only about 110, it goes to a 210 gal. tank and that seems to be fine. the trees do not seem to run as well as i would like, but i think it is a problem with the laterals, not the fact that it is a 1/2 in. mainline.

Gerry

[lobstafari]

Good to know...THANKS!! I have a few short stretches Id like to switch off buckets, but cant justify going all out. Mainline should be around 5 percent, and laterals, just guessing might be around 10-12 percent, and about 40 taps per 1/2" line. Maybe Ill give that a shot and be able to pull it off. :idea: :idea: :!: 8) :D

[mapleman3]

I will let you know how mine do although the slope odf the 2 bushes I have are different, the bush behind my barn will be about 110 on 1/2" but flat(possible vac setup) the other will be also around 100 but good slope on 3/4, it will be interesting if the 1/2" on vac does better. both are running into 180 gal tanks

[lobstafari]

Oh yeah Chris,
One time i couldnt find my site level, so measured off 100' of string, got it level, then measured 4' up, on the uphill end. When I found my site level, I checked it, and it was REALLY close to right on. So if you dont have one, Id save the 20 bucks and just borrow a 4' level, line level, or whatever you might have around.

[backyardsugarer]

I am going with a 400 gallon tank because I was able to buy it for $50. As far as the 3/4" line I am told that you are limited with the fittings with 1/2" and if I ever do add on and become bigger I will wish that I had the 3/4" to begin with. I was ready to go 1/2" but the dealer kind of talked me out of it, however I have not bought anything yet. I plan on using that tank to collect from the 75 or so buckets that I will have out. Right now I am trying to dig out a low spot in the snow for it. At least the sap will stay good and cold with all the snow we have here in NY. :lol:

Chris

[lobstafari]

Sweet deal on the tank!! We dont really have as big a dairy industry as you do in NY, so I got a 500 gal for $300, and that was a huge bargain for around here. Came with a compressor, but its an old freon rig....maybe someday It'll chill too. Good point on the fittings I noticed that now that you mention it. I ran into the same problem with one of those poly cube tanks...my line comes in at about 3% grade because its so level. My parents probably would be upset if I dug down in their paved turn around though!! :)

[mapleman3]

Jeremy, thats the type of tank I'd love to get a hold of, and have fun tinkering with the refrigeration system to get it running, is it r-12 refrigerant?

[lobstafari]

I have NO CLUE!! Its a Milkkeeper tank about 25 years old. I dont know anything about that stuff.

[mapleman3]

be fun to try to get going :)

[themapleking]

3/4" main line would be better. You can't get saddle fittings for 1/2 " they're easy to install. Just drill 5/16 hole clamp them on and install the lat line. You would have to cut the 1/2 and install a main line Tee and clamp it for your lat lines. Keep your main lines 5% min.
Your better off with a little larger line. When the sap is flowing good it will not fill your main line full " air pockets ". You all ways want your main line about 1/2 full with the heavest run. That way you have air flowing up helping to pull the sap down.
If its full with sap you'll get air pockets in the lines and slow the sap down. Better chanch of freezeing. Make sense. Put your finger on a straw with water hold it up and the water stays in. Tilt the straw and let the air go past the water and what happens? thats right.

[michaelh05478]

I have a question for you guys with pipe lines!!! WIll 12 ga wire be ok to run?? Ill have 2-3 lines about 400 ft or so long??? The trees are pretty close together! Thanks...I hope to start this monday or next weekend!

[mapleman3]

Mike ... in the bush behind my house I only had 12 ga. so I doubled it up... had quite a few limbs fall on it since the fall, one limb was pretty heavy and put alot of stress on it, still didn't break, my other bush I did 9 gauge....

[michaelh05478]

Jim, Thanks for your info...Ill use the 12 ga....Im using it because at the maple seminar in Essex last weekend they said at the Proctor research center in underhill 3 mfg ran 3 seperate lines and they all use 12 ga wire!!! I figure if its good enough for them it should be ok for me!!!!!!!! I also bought a few wire drippers incase i needed them!!!!!!! Good luck to you this year!!, I will be working on the road monday, i have a bulldoezer and a skidder i can use to plow the snow with....Only problem i see is the 50 or so deer in front of the sugar house in the corn we planted last fall!!!!! It sure is nice to see them there!!!.... :lol: :lol:

[lobstafari]

12 ga. is certainly a lot easier to come by. Most guys use 9 ga. with 12 ga support wire.....that way the 12 ga will break first (hopefully). Thats one advantage you lose, might just have to fix it a lot. Id think it would be ok as far as getting tension. Spreading 12 ga in a field is a lot easier than in the woods. Point being, DONT KINK IT!! :lol: or it'll break shortly after. You could also use cable if you had some...its strong and doesnt stretch much. I go with the "use what you have philosophy", which doesnt always work perfectly, but is a lot cheaper sometimes, and maybe you invent something new and better!! I think thats how most of this stuff evolved anyhow. Good to get lines up off the ground somehow anyway.....thats what really counts.

[Michaelh05478]

Thanks for the info!!!! Ill let you know how it works out..

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Michael,

I used 14 gauge for all my lines. I have several 5/16" lines on wire so I don't have to stretch them and they are permanent, but I also have 1/2" mainline on it also and seems to do fine.

[Michaelh05478]

Thanks for the Info Brandon! It wont be long and we'll be out there boiling!!!! Hope you have a good year!!

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Mike,

Same to you! It is -3 here this morning when I left at 6:30 and they have changed the forecast again, so I am going to tap next Saturday!

Good luck with the beautiful new evaporator you have!

[mapleman3]

jeeze Brandon, maybe you will be pushed all the way back to our Tapping time :(
I sure was hoping to here your weather was cooperating :\
well maybe next weeks weather will turn out great.
I'm running to go look at a 350 Gal SS tank in the next hour, hope he has some other goodies for sale too :) :) :)

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Jim,

Let me know about the tank. I will be waiting to see pics on your website! :D :D